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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi folks, well after hearing a couple negatives about Hornaday ammo & reading thru our AMMO EFFECTIVENESS thread, I guess it's not that great as I was told by my local shop, anyways with those listed in the chart what would be the best overall defense ammo for a m&p 40c....thank you in advance
 

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I run Hornady Critical Defense in all my EDC, Never a problem yet. I have run quite a few rounds down range from each without a cycle failure. That's just me.

I started with federal Guard dog and this is what they looked like after just sitting in the mags a few weeks, not cycled. Federal replaced them and the replacements did the same. Guess what? I decided to switch to Hornady, sent all the federals downrange, they all went bang. Go figure. I ALWAYS check for setback though and rotate rounds in the mag if I have to cycle them out of the chamber. I invest in new ammo every year on the anniversary date of the gun, send the old stuff down range. I know it's anal replacing every year but it makes me feel better. YMMV.:stuart:

Just a note: my backup mags are JHP
 

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No Hornady problem here

I've always used Hornady in many of my rifles and pistols. Never had one problem running the Critical Defense line in any firearm, especially my M&P, 5906, 6906, etc.
 

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You've already made a good decision by turning your back on boutique ammo, no good reason to chew that cabbage twice (no matter what the fanbois say).

There are several great ammo choices, the best (and most expensive, by far) is anything with the Barnes X-bullet. These are the most consistent for penetration and expansion.
Beyond that are the most popular duty ammo choices, Speer Gold Dot, Federal HST, and Winchester Tactical/Ranger/Ranger-t/Bonded. These are in more police issued handguns than any other brand, and are the best choice for those of us who can't justify the additional expense of the Barnes loadings.

The next tier in duty/defensive ammo includes the Golden Saber line from Remington. Not as consistent when it comes to expantion, but good enough for several police depts. to choose it as their issue ammo.

Lighter bullets in the 115 and 155 gr. range (115/155 gr. Barnes X-bullets being the exception) are generally less effective than the heavier 124/147 gr. 9mm options and 165/180gr. in 40S&W
 

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I run Hornady Critical Defense in all my EDC, Never a problem yet. I have run quite a few rounds down range from each without a cycle failure. That's just me.

KR,
I almost always agree with you, I feel insulted! LOL. The gent asked for opinions on best overall defense ammo in a .40c, I gave him mine.
Thanks,
Chuck

You've already made a good decision by turning your back on boutique ammo, no good reason to chew that cabbage twice (no matter what the fanbois say).
 

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You can get on you tube and see expansion tests for many of the most popular brands of ammo. Most use the 4 layers of denim and gel. I personally carry federal 147gr. Hst in my 9mm..
 

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Hi folks, well after hearing a couple negatives about Hornaday ammo & reading thru our AMMO EFFECTIVENESS thread, I guess it's not that great as I was told by my local shop, anyways with those listed in the chart what would be the best overall defense ammo for a m&p 40c....thank you in advance
Here we go again. I have used all of the above. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Hornady Critical Defense. It costs more which is one reason that I primarily run Federal HST. A lot of folks on this forum don't shoot their self defense ammo real regularly. I do. I run a couple of mags through on every range trip. Back during the ammo shortage, the only thing that I could get my hands on was either Critical Duty or Critical Defense and I bought it. It ran just fine. The only problem they I have with it is the costs. I generally use either Federal or Winchester as I can usually find them at much better prices. Don't del bad.
 

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The gent asked for opinions on best overall defense ammo in a .40c, I gave him mine.
I didn't realize that's what he was asking. Lets take another look.

...anyways with those listed in the chart (presumably DocGKR's chart, which does NOT include Critical Mistake) what would be the best overall defense ammo for a m&p 40c...
So, don't be insulted, you just read the OP's request incorrectly.
 

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You've already made a good decision by turning your back on boutique ammo, no good reason to chew that cabbage twice (no matter what the fanbois say).

There are several great ammo choices, the best (and most expensive, by far) is anything with the Barnes X-bullet. These are the most consistent for penetration and expansion.
Beyond that are the most popular duty ammo choices, Speer Gold Dot, Federal HST, and Winchester Tactical/Ranger/Ranger-t/Bonded. These are in more police issued handguns than any other brand, and are the best choice for those of us who can't justify the additional expense of the Barnes loadings.

The next tier in duty/defensive ammo includes the Golden Saber line from Remington. Not as consistent when it comes to expantion, but good enough for several police depts. to choose it as their issue ammo.

Lighter bullets in the 115 and 155 gr. range (115/155 gr. Barnes X-bullets being the exception) are generally less effective than the heavier 124/147 gr. 9mm options and 165/180gr. in 40S&W
Great explanation! I hadn't thought of it this way, but it's true!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Here we go again. I have used all of the above. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Hornady Critical Defense. It costs more which is one reason that I primarily run Federal HST. A lot of folks on this forum don't shoot their self defense ammo real regularly. I do. I run a couple of mags through on every range trip. Back during the ammo shortage, the only thing that I could get my hands on was either Critical Duty or Critical Defense and I bought it. It ran just fine. The only problem they I have with it is the costs. I generally use either Federal or Winchester as I can usually find them at much better prices. Don't del bad.
I just ASKED a QUESTION , NOT trying to get people ticked off,agravated, just asked a simple question, I'm NEW to all this so excuse me for my lack of experience, which is why I turn to you guy's who've done this for a bit, I usualy shoot 1 mag of the Hornaday Critical Defence every time at the range ( once a week) I have no problem's so far just want to make sure I'll be able to stop someone in their tracks SHOULD (GOD forbid) something happened, I saw the chart and the review wasn't good from what I could tell ( I could be wrong) so I wanted to ask, NOT trying to get into a debate or anything, at least I read the other thread first before asking that's gotta count for something :mellow:
 

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You did well. I was not criticizing you. I apologize of I offended you. There are no dumb questions.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 

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So sorry you got caught up in this ongoing debate. It's nothing you said, in fact it probably has more to do with what I said. Keeter1911 and I are friends, in fact he has bought quite a bit of ammo from me, but we do have differing opinions on some things. I try to stick with the opinions of nationally accepted terminal ballistics experts (including DocGKR), while others may refer to Youtube and social media networks for ballistic comparisons (not that there's anything wrong with that).

It's likely I'll get blasted for these comments too, try not to take it personally (because I won't).
 

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Discussion Starter #15
NOT offended at all, we're all GOOD :), this is why the interweb is bad at times, can't tell emotions :crazy:
 

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Coming in late in the thread I know, but what problems were people having with the Hornady? I've gone through a couple boxes of Critical Defense with no loading problems so far. Not a ton of experience on my end, mostly an availability thing (where I snag my ammo it was that or hydra-shock), but what issues have people had?
 

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I have had zero problems with either Critical Defense or Critical Duty. See someone is calling it boutique ammo. Trying to be cute I guess.
 

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I have had zero problems with either Critical Defense or Critical Duty. See someone is calling it boutique ammo. Trying to be cute I guess.
Same, though I donated my CDuty to a buddy of mine with an XDM and picked up CDefense for myself because it's designed for shorter barrel handguns.

I steer clear of Hydra-Shock just because I believe it's designed on a faulty premise but other than that so long as it loads fine, I have no problems with any JHP from a major manufacturer. I don't care if ammo is considered the "best," because that's entirely situational, I care if it's effective for most self defense situations, which the afore-mentioned types generally are.
 

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Boutique Ammo isn't a term I just made up, it's a generally accepted term for small ammo manufactures like Hornady and Extreme Shock.

DocGKR has reviewed Hornady's Critical Defense (which fails FBI protocols) and because of their propensity for failure was not able to recommend them, in fact quite the opposite. You might want to look into his findings before proceeding.

As always, you're welcome to your own opinion.

P.S. Pistol ammo is woefully inadequate for "the job".
My response hasn't changed.

P.S. If you're interested in some Federal HST ammo, 9mm 124 gr. in 50 rounds boxes for under $30 (less than 60 cants a round, how does that compare to the cost of your Critical Mistake?), follow this link, or this link, or this link... I could do this all day. Even Ammunition To Go says they have some, caveat emptor.
 

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Realized my post was stupidly long, so I'll sum up.

The only DocGKR post I saw specifically denouncing CD was made from a 1 7/8" .38 Special, where the bare gel had mediocre expansion and the denim failed to expand.

Apples, meet oranges.

I have yet to see the actual results of the tests on 9mm and 40, though I did see mention of the intent to test, but saw no results, except that as of February '13, Critical Duty 220 gr +P was added to the .45 ACP list. I understand that Doc does not update the list with EVERY type of ammo that doesn't make the list, and this is not irrevokable proof that ALL CD (whichever variety) ammo will reliably penetrate between 12-18" across all cartridges or across all platforms, but it does lend some credence to the bullet design.

While DocGKR's list is by far the most inclusive list of SD ammo, it is not the be-all end-all list. Not looking to stir the pot, I just haven't seen Doc's tests on CD in a 9mm or .40 S&W automatic, so I can't rightly say that it isn't effective. . .then again I can't rightly say that it is, either. Would I take it over FMJ? Yes. Am I waiting for some Fed HST to be delivered? HELL yes.

I am not a Hornady fan-boy and I have no brand loyalty when it comes to protecting myself and my family. Like the OP, I'm new to this and I got what was available and what I had seen some tests on. Frankly, I don't care if it's made in Slobovia and looks like crap, if it feeds and fires without blowing my face up and penetrates reliably, I'm good with it.
 
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