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Discussion Starter #1
I've noticed that there is a build up of what appears to be unburt powder at the end of my barrel, This build up occurs at the buisness end and usually at the top (not sure if that means anything).

It also seems to be happening more with my reloads with titegoup then it did when I was using purchased Federal rounds. When you look down the barrel it almost looks af if it's pitted but I know that's not the case as I had managed to remove all the build up before.



Anyway, after my range trip this weekend I wasn't able to get it all cleaned out. I used a brass bristle brush & some cotten mops + let some Tetra Gun Solven sit in the barrel for a good 2 hours .... but in the end there was still some visible residue on the barrel. Even tried q-tips but that didn't help much, worth a shot though.



Just wondering if there's something else out there the help remove some of the more difficult residue ...... either a chemical or some other type of brush.
 

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Titegroup leaves a fine residue more so then other powders, but I use it myself. it will leave this residue on the outside of the gun and the inside as well. Try running an old fashioned patch with some stronger bore solvent through the barrel and let it stand wet for a few minutes before you start scrubing, it should come out. If that doesn't work you can use some mild abrasive paste on a patch, like JB bore paste. Also you may want to try some Gun Scrubber or even brake cleaning fluid.



That said, I'll express a less then popular position and I'll advice to you to don't worry so much about cleaning your barrel unless you are shooting lead or moly coated bullets. Powder residue and thin copper deposits will not harm you barrel any. Keep your chamber clean, but don't worry about making your barrel shiny. A lot of the cleaning practices still recomended by everyone come from the days of corosive primer compounds and hydroscopic powder residue. By all means, clean your guns as much as you want to if it makes you feel better, but there is no reason to go crazy over it. I can tell you that I've put over 30k rounds through the same barrel (on a CZ75) after the first few 1k's my barrel cleaning has been a CLP sprayed boresnake pulled through a couple of times every 500 to 1000 rounds. Towards the end the accuracy started to go but that was from honest lands wear.



My USPSA guns get cleaned when I can't stand the sight of them anymore or when my hands get to nasty from handling them. I keep them lubed but I don't obsess over making the shiny. A lot of USPSA shooters I know do pretty much the same, though some are certainly religious about cleaning their guns.
 

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What kind of bullets are you using? I just can't see powder fouling that wouldn't clean out with a powder solvent and a brass/bronze brush.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I'm using Berrys copepr plated loads (165grn & 180grn), before that it was 165grn FMJ Federal.



I'm not so much worried about cleaning it 100% since it does seem to shoot fine with a little build up in it ..... but I don't want that build up to get to out of hand either. I usually clean after every range trip which is about 200-300 rounds per visit.



I'd try to take a pic but I seriously doubt it would come out good .... especially since after the final lube & mop you really can't see it anymore, I can get most of it out but not all of it. I've tried the brake cleaner as well but that doesn't get it out either.



I do like my slide looking nice though ..... but that's easy to do. After I clean it I rub in a small amount of lube by hand & buff with a cloth. Makes it look nice & clean with a slight shine while protecting it from rust. Plus that fine coat of lub doesn't seem to collect any powder or dirt which is good.
 

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I have used brake cleaner but that stuff scares me! Nothing I have ever used works as well but it makes me wonder if it is hard on the metal. I read somewhere that one of the major manf. uses nothing else.

I have also heard that copper remover should not be used in a stainless barrel as a good portion of stainless steel is copper. This was supposed to have come from Douglas Barrels.

I use Hoppes #9 but would sure like to find something better.

I just gave my M&P .45 the Mil Tec treatment in hopes of making it easier to clean.

I, for one, would like to hear some comments on bore cleaners.
 

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That's weird, I use Berrys bullets, but not Titegroup, but I've never really seen anything like that!
 

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My favorite "ok, you are coming clean, damn you!" cleaner is Sweets 7.62, but you really want to play with that outdoors and follow the directions. Keep your nose WELL clear of the bottle and patches or you will regret it. Trust me on this. It will not damage the steel but you will regret it if you sniff it to hard.
 

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When you use Sweets you need to get some nylon brushes, it dissolves the normal bronze/brass brushes, it's a great copper remover, I use it in my rifles.
 

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You need nylon brushes but thats only if you choose to scrub with them which is not what they put in the instruction. The normal method is apply with patch, let is sit, and then remove with patches, repeat if necesary.
 

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45guy said:
...I have also heard that copper remover should not be used in a stainless barrel as a good portion of stainless steel is copper. This was supposed to have come from Douglas Barrels...


There should be no copper found in any grade of stainless steel. If there is it would be considered a contaminant. Aside from Iron, grades of SST consist of various percentages of Carbon, Manganese, Phoshorus, Sulfur, Silicon, Chromium, Nickel and Molybdenum. So you should be safe in using Sweets on an SST barrel. Just be carefull as it can etch the barrel if you leave it in there for a long time. It will also etch your nose if you get a good wiff of that stuff.



Since youre using plated bullets you may want to consider your load. Are you loading for jacketed rounds or lead? Plated is not equal to jacketed so you should be loading for lead rounds. If youre pushing plated rounds at jacketed velocities, that stuff you cant clean may be lead.
 

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I've used Gunslick's Copper-Klenz...it works okay. I consider Hoppes and Butches Bore Shine my primaries.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
TAZ said:
Since youre using plated bullets you may want to consider your load. Are you loading for jacketed rounds or lead? Plated is not equal to jacketed so you should be loading for lead rounds. If youre pushing plated rounds at jacketed velocities, that stuff you cant clean may be lead.


I checked my manuals and there isn't anything in there on lead loads with titegroup so I have nothing to compare to. If anyone has that info and wants to share :wink:



But here's what I've been loading at;



165grn

1.126

4.6grn titegroup

0.419 crimp



180grn

1.126

4.2grn titegroup

0.419 crimp



I've recently upped the seating to 1.130 which seems to work better then the 1.126. The amount of powder I've been using is 10% less then the max for FMJ loads, Also, I was thinkin of reducing the powder charge by about 0.1-0.2 grains from above amounts.



I did try 50 round each using this;



165grn w/ 4.2grn titegroup & 180grn w/ 3.8grn titegroup



But that turned out to be a very "dirty" load, I had powder all over my arm from that. There wasn't much recoil to speak of but can't say much for accuracy either.



Starting to sound more like this belongs in the ammo bunker forum :roll:
 

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Titegroup is cleaner at higher pressures, as you reduce the powder charge you get lower pressures and more residue.
 
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