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Discussion Starter #1
Myself and three other friends had pretty much thought that the full-sized M&P was the pistol to get given the ergonomics and reputation of S&W. Unfortunately, after reading the various issues with the magazine either locking prematurely or dropping early, I'm beginning to wonder if our decision is the proper one or not. We've not purchased them yet, and after taking a Fighting Pistol training class which wholeheartedly subscribe to the Glock way of thinking, I wonder if we should look more at the Glock 19 instead. Other than training, I need to know that the gun will operate 100% when called on in a self defense situation.
 

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Remember that when you look at a message board like this one, you see a concentration of the problems that people run into, when in reality there are very few, but it wouldn't be much of a message board if people only posted how good their pistols are!



I've been on this board for a while now, and not one time have I made a post saying my pistol is just about perfect, when something is good, people rarely comment on it, but when something is bad, they usually don't hesitate to make it known!



Oh yes...those Glocks...they aren't quite perfect either!







I haven't seen any letters like this about the Smith M&P series:



REQUEST FOR REGIONAL BROADCAST



ATTENTION DEPARTMENTS WITH GLOCK HANDGUNS



THE HADDON HEIGHTS NEW JERSEY POLICE DEPARTMENT TOOK DELIVERY OF TWENTY (20) GLOCK MODEL #22, 40 CALIBER HANDGUNS, SERIAL #S KNX803 THRU KNX823 AND FOUR (4) GLOCK MODEL #27, 40 CALIBER HANDGUNS SERIAL #S KNA564 THRU KNA567 IN DECEMBER 2006. SINCE THEN THIS DEPARTMENT HAS EXPERIENCED NUMEROUS FAILURE TO EJECT, AND STOVEPIPE ISSUES WITH MOST OF THESE WEAPONS.



THIS DEPARTMENT USES 180 GRAIN FEDERAL BALL AMMO FOR PRACTICE AND QUALIFICATION AND 180 GRAIN FEDERAL HYDRA-SHOK FOR DUTY USE. MANY OTHER AMMO TYPES AND MANUFACTURERS WERE TESTED, EACH HAVING FAILURES TO EJECT AND STOVEPIPES. THE FACTORY REPRESENTATIVE HAS CHANGED SEVERAL INTERNAL PARTS INCLUDING EJECTORS AND EXTRACTORS WITHOUT SOLVING THE PROBLEMS AND RECOMMENDED ALL THE NEW WEAPONS BE TAKEN OUT OF SERVICE. AT THIS TIME GLOCK HAS BEEN UNABLE TO SOLVE THE PROBLEM.



ANY DEPARTMENT HAVING SIMILAR ISSUES, PLEASE CONTACT CHIEF RONALD SHUTE AT 856-547-0614 EXT #11 OR BY E-MAIL AT [email protected]



CAMDEN CO POLICE COMM NJ004O63N MG 1148ET


From: Chief Ronald S. Shute

Date: 1 March 2007



Dean,



I have had many responses to my teletype; the most disturbing came from the Indiana State Police. I learned that they took delivery of 1,375 Glock Model 22s in August of 2005 and immediately started to have stovepipes and failure to eject issues.



ISP did extensive testing and concluded that there was a problem with the weapon. Glock representatives were unable to resolve the problem and as a result all the Model 22s were returned to Glock1.



After my problems became apparent, our Glock representative implied that the issues were possibly due to the ammunition that we were using. I personally witnessed the rep shoot four other brands of ammo, all with numerous stovepipes and failure to ejects, concluding that it was not an ammunition created problem.



If I can be of any further help, please do not hesitate to contact my office.

Sincerely,

Chief Ronald S. Shute

Haddon Heights Police
 

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G56 is right. It's a new gun, I think most of the bugs have been worked out of it. Problem was, guys like us have been screaming for these pistols for over 2 years so it's my opinion that they may have rushed them to productiom. No serious issues with the guns though. Mine had to go back for an extractor replacement. S&W has been great to deal with. Most importantly they listen when there is a problem. I have over 2000 rounds through mine and no failures. Consider the ammo you buy as well. Cheap ammo will result in inconsistent results. You get what you pay for. I carry my M&P every day with confidence. Buy one, bring it to the range with some decent range ammo and you'll see what I'm talking about.
 

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I've made it well known that I'm a Glock guy on these boards. I have been for a long time and I've never had a problem with any of them. I was VERY weary of the M&P but from an ergonomics standpoint I loved it.



Yes there are some issues with them; mag dropping, slides locking back, failures to eject with the empty case still in the chamber, etc. but I believe that S&W is working these issues out in an impressive manner.



However, at this point, if I could only own one I would still choose my G19 because of the reliability edge and the accessories and parts support. I don't think that will be my answer in 6 or 12 months but right now I'd still go with the Glock.



I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with G56's argument. The reason we don't see letters like that is because by comparison there simply aren't many PDs using the M&P. I hope we never see one of those letters but all it's going to take is one bad batch of ammo and then the M&P will have the same internet stigma as the Glock. Same with the blown up Glock in the picture. We've already seen one KB in an M&P due to ammo. I don't think anyone here wants to start down that slope. KBs can happen to any gun (I had one in a H&K USP) so be careful about using them to discredit another brand because when we start seeing more here people will think the M&P is no better than what we discredited in the first place. Yukon and I have seen it time and time again on another forum.
 

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As someone said, you hear a vocal minority with problems here and rarely hear the majority who have had no such problems. Furthermore, not many of those with problems are complaining loudly because Smith & Wesson is swift to correct the situation. Very swift.



Our M&P 9c had a problem with the slide locking back prematurely on the last round in the magazine. S&W knows that this issue exists with some of their guns and the fix is quick and costs you nothing, even in terms of overnight shipping. Our gun was sent back to us within 5 days with a stronger slide release lever spring installed. Zero problems since!



I'd buy an M&P with confidence.
 

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Smith & Wesson hasn't been in business this long by making cheap crap and screwing people over.

They have great CS and awesome warranties, even on firearms not beloning to their original owners. I post the good with the bad, but if my model X with infinite number of rounds through it finally breaks in half, I'll post it with pics but i wont b!tch about it. I've read alot of people complaining about certain companys' cs and I've had some friends get screwed over big time others. S&W backs up there products.
 

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I felt the same way!! I had two Glocks at the time. Bought the M&P40 and love it!! I shot about 500 rds and 2 competitions with it now, awesome gun and zero problems!! Don't hesitate, but get the carry kit, much better value!!
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I've had good luck with their 1911PD and am hoping for the same thing with the M&P. It does make me a bit hesitant when folks claim reliability by saying that they've shot 400 or 800 rounds total with no issues when one defensive pistol class can have you going through that many rounds in a day.



Also, I fully understand the bad ammo thing. In the class that I took, three of us were using 1911's and all had the same cheap .45 ammo. Each of us had FTF issues which got us chastised for 4 days.



We are looking to get the "kit" as it looks like a good value.
 

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I have a Glock 22 40/357, Serial #HES2**, never any failures of any kind. Have a new M&P45, about 2 months old, perfect, very,very accurate, and much nicer to shoot than my Glock
 

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ske1eter said



"I've had good luck with their 1911PD and am hoping for the same thing with the M&P. It does make me a bit hesitant when folks claim reliability by saying that they've shot 400 or 800 rounds total...."



Well. I have over 6000 rds since January with no failures of any kind. I am no metallurgist, nor am I a an armorer, but I look at the internals and there is nothing there that tells me this gun should not be as robust as Glocks, Sigs, or HK's.
 
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