[dustinnicholson215]

So I'll start off by saying that I am by no means a crack shot, but I shoot well enough to know when something has gone awry. Earlier today I went outside to do some target practice. I fired about 150 rounds of American Eagle FMJ in 10 round sets from 25 yards getting consistent 5 1/2" groupings. Finished off the box and popped open a box of Winchester White Box. Immediately i couldn't even hit the 1'x1' target until I was 10 or so yards away, and even then it was all over the page. My weapon had a few FTF and FTE in this time as well. The FTFs were ran through a different gun and still no Boom Boom. Just to make sure it wasn't my guns I fired a mag of Hydra-Shoks. All fired, cycled, and grouped even smaller than my AE ammo. I opened a new box of AE and everything was back to normal. Upon policing the brass, I noticed that all of the Winchester casings seemed to be burned substantially more than the Federal casings (AE and Hydra-Shoks). Any ideas as to what happened with the WIN ammo? Anyone had this issue before?

Weapon: 2013 M&P 40 Full Size. Completely Stock
:question:

 

[LordRahl]

Sounds like you might have gotten a bad box of WWB.

I have been using WWB for almost 6 years and it have shot pretty consistent groupings. I think I may have had one failure to fire in all that time.

I suggest you note the lot number on the box. If you have a box with a different lot number, try shooting that and see if the same thing happens.

 

[Bill in Tx]

WWB shoots and groups fine through all three of my M&P's. I shoot a lot of this kind of ammo. Because it's what the Wal-Marts in my area mostly stock.

I think Lord Rahl is right. Looks like you got a bad box.

 

[dustinnicholson215]

Thanks guys. Yea I've used it for years as well. It's just the extensive burns and discoloration on the casings that have me worried. I'm really just worried if I get another bad box it will damage my pistol. Just being a worry wart lol

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[Texas40]

I stopped buying WWB ammo. The few FTE and FTFs Ive had with any of my semo auto pistols was with WWB ammo.
I shot all the other inexpensive brands sold in the stores around me (Bass Pro Academy Cabelas etc) and all works fine with no malfunctions. I wont buy or shot any WWB stuff.

 

[agksimon]

I use the WWB 9mm 115 grain FMJ and consistently sandbag rest 3" groups at 25 yards with my M&P9c.

 

[konertjm]

I have a full size M&P .40 as well. WWB has been the most inconsistent bulk ammo that I have used. To the point that I don't use it anymore if I have any choice.

I too had the 'burned brass' effect on the WWB that I did use, as well as FTF and FTE on occasion, this was the exception rather than the rule, but I did not have those problems with other bulk ammo.
I do not have any problems with Federal bulk, Remington bulk, or regular Winchester 50 round (non white box) in various bullet designs.

 

[Keeter1911]

+1 on the bad batch/box. I shoot quite a bit of WWB and have never had the problems that you describe.

 

[ginzo]

Another +1

+1 on the bad batch/box. I shoot quite a bit of WWB and have never had the problems that you describe.

 

[AGoyette]

After reading various threads about WWB ammo, I personally tend to stay away from it. Not to hard since we got the reloader up and running. I did shoot a box of PMC 9mm 115 grain ammo the other day. I sure felt nice coming out of the gun. So much so, I talked the husband into letting me buy 11 boxes of it at the gun show. No worries about it being reloads since it was in a freshly opened box. I told him that it was nice to have some factory ammo so if we have issues we can make sure it is whether it is gun or reloads related.

 

[G56]

The burned appearance you are talking about means they didn't get a good gas seal around the case and some of the gasses leaked back into the chamber. This is usually an indication of a load that is too light, not expanding the cases enough to seal properly, maybe the loads were a little light or maybe its a batch of brass that's harder than usual, hard to say exactly. It isn't hurting anything, just means some additional cleaning is needed.

 

[dennis40x]

I'm somewhat skeptical about problems with WWB and especially so when Wal-Mart is associated and then brought into the discussion. It seems to be a repetitive subject on different forums. I've used WWB extensively 45ACP and 9mm-Luger if it were problematic I would not use.

Occasionally all manufactures have quality issues on occasion and some to the point of having recall issued. I'm not saying that there can not be issue with WWB but its not as prevalent as the chatter on forums would indicate. If it were that prevalent with quality issues as others have opinioned I would not use or buy it.

Fifty years of pistol shooting staring at Parris-Island I'm not shy about pointing out what works and what doesn't.

 

[Sailingterry007]

I too have had problems with wwb, mostly fte. I had a gunsmith instal a Apex tactical fre extractor and haven't had a problem since. He said it's due to the thin rim on the casing. Never had a accuracy problem with them though. I try not to buy wwb unless it's the only thing I can get. Never had any problems with the rest of the bulk ammo.

 

[dennis40x]

I too have had problems with wwb, mostly fte. I had a gunsmith instal a Apex tactical fre extractor and haven't had a problem since. He said it's due to the thin rim on the casing.

I measured the case rim thickness on 45ACP RA 60 match, WWB, PPU, Federal and Blazer Brass. The maximum rim thickness difference was Max-Min .003 of an inch

I measured the case rim thickness on 9mm-Luger Federal, PPU, Speer, RWS, Geco, and WWB.The maximum rim thickness difference was Max-Min .005 of an inch.

I do not have a 40S&W but with in reason similar tolerances would most likely apply.

In both the 45ACP and the 9mm Luger, WWB did not have the thinness case rim thickness measured compared to the other cases specified.

 

[dustinnicholson215]

UPDATE: After contacting Winchester with the batch number, they informed me that they had received numerous complaints with that batch number and numbers close to that. Apparently they had "extreme powder charge variances of unknown origin" in those batches. Took a few of the remaining rounds from that box to a friend who reloads and is familiar with Winchester's standard powder charges. When he took apart the rounds, it was amazing even just the visual differences there were with the size of the powder charges. He said some were less than half of what was normal and some were pushing double the normal amount. With the news of Winchester recalling 22lr ammo due to double powder charges, I think I'll just steer clear for a while. On a happier note, I noticed the night after shooting that my left dot on my rear sight had come out and that my slide felt a little loose. Called S&W and they are replacing the sight, checking the weapon thoroughly, and have offered to install the factory updated parts that have been announced since I bought the weapon. ALL FOR NO CHARGE!!! Wow!! Amazing CS

 

[92gli]

Whats the lot #? I just bought some at wal mart yesterday.

 

[Sailingterry007]

Wwb is made czech republic, has been for the last few years. I think it's made by Steller & Bellot they make millions of rounds of ammo. The quality control can't be as good as the ammo made on the US so I expect a few bad rounds in a box. I too so like many others buy at Wal-Mart, it's the only thing I can find in target ammo. I guess it's the price you pay for availability.

 

[dennis40x]

Wwb is made czech republic, has been for the last few years. .

I simply ask this why are the WWB marked "Made In The USA" and that is ammunition purchased over the last several years. I also have letter from Winchester stating in uncertain terms that WWB is produced in the United States.

The statement you made about rim thickness was not valid either. See my post #14 referencing the different ammunition brands that I measured the rim thickness on the cartridge cases.

 

[dustinnicholson215]

Whats the lot #? I just bought some at wal mart yesterday.

It was ammo that was shipped to Dick's Sporting Goods. I don't remember the lot number off the top of my head but I will look at the email tomorrow and post it.

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[dennis40x]

An example of the misinformation concerning WWB lets use as an example the 100 round value pack of 45ACP. On five sides of the box marked in Grey Lettering on white background MADE IN USA and marked on one side in Red Lettering Made IN USA.
Ok now the 9mm Luger 100 round value pack four places on the encircled in a twelve star pattern MADE IN USA in Red Lettering.
The nonfactual commentary on the country of origin is an example of ( ) fill in the blank. :wallbash: