[Monkey Dust]

I know the manual says no +p or +p+, but do you guys think the speer 200gr +p gold dot will hurt the M&P45? I got a good deal on a case. FWIW, I would hate to hear that the M&P is a non +p 45, especially since S&W wants to compete with Glock.

 

[josh]

I've always heard +P is fine in the M&P's, but not +P+? I use +P in my 9c and Federal Tactical HST 230gr. +P in my M&P45 with no issues.

 

[sholling]

I just think of non +P as practice ammo and +P as social work (defensive) ammo.

 

[ToddG]

The manual for the M&P45 prohibits +p? I'm surprised.



There is no such thing as +P+ .45 ammo, and I would never use anything labeled as such.

 

[choochboost]

I know the manual says no +p or +p+.

Does it? I don't have a MP45 but many pistol manuals are not caliber specific. My M&P manuals do not say no +p.

 

[Steelshooter]

I would shoot it enough to know it works but not for practice. Of course its too expensive for practice anyway. Personally I think 200 grain is plenty fast enough without needing +P.

 

[choochboost]

Personally I think 200 grain is plenty fast enough without needing +P.

That round is the one "red-headed stepchild" (so to speak) in the Gold Dot line.

 

[Steelshooter]

How is that?

 

[choochboost]

You don't want to know. :wink:



The 200gr +p Gold Dot did not do well in DocGKR's tests. He's hard to please so I tend to follow his recommendations. YMMV.

 

[Steelshooter]

But it blew up my water jug real good! Kidding. :wink:

 

[tsix]

Taken directly from the M&P 45 manual. Note that the reference to NOT use the +P is for old K frame revolvers.



Using +P in your M&P 45 is perfectly fine.



NO +P+, however!





"Plus-P" (+P) ammunition generates pressures in excess of the

pressures associated with standard ammunition. Such pressures

may affect the wear characteristics or exceed the margin of safe-

ty built into some revolvers and could therefore be DANGER-

OUS. This ammunition should not be used in Smith &Wesson

medium (K frame) revolvers manufactured prior to 1958. Such

pre-1958 medium (K-frame) revolvers can be identified by the

absence of a model number stamped inside the yoke cut of the

frame. (i.e., the area of the frame exposed when the cylinder is

in the open position.



"Plus-P-Plus (+P+) ammunition must not be used in Smith &

Wesson firearms. This marking on the ammunition designates

that it exceeds established industry standards, but the designation

does not represent defined pressure limits and therefore such

ammunition may vary significantly as to the pressures generated.



Your welcome!

 

[Steelshooter]

I'm not aware there is such a thing as +P+ .45.

 

[ToddG]

There is no official SAAMI specification for "+p+" in any caliber.



However, it is a common designation used for 9mm and .38 Special ammunition that is loaded past the SAAMI-recognized +p specification (38,500psi MAP for 9X19mm +p; 18,500psi MAP for .38 Special +p).



There are only +p specifications for:

• .38 Special
  
• 9X19mm
  
• .38 Super Auto
  
• .45 Auto
  
• 257 Roberts
  • 
    
    
    
    Anything marked "+p" that is not one of the above is not loaded to industry-accepted standards. Anything marked "+p+" is not loaded to industry-accepted standards.

 

[BrokenArrow]

Speer GD ammo in gel through FBI heavy cloth:



185 GD 14.75/.68

200 +P GD 18.8/.55

230 GD 14.3/.70

 

[Steelshooter]

FBI heavy cloth? WTH is that?

 

[cancow]

I don't think it is a good idea to use +p in any plastic gun. Maybe in a 9mm though. Besides there is no point in using such ammo unless you are defending against a dangerous animal such as a bear.

 

[Flyin_.45]

How the hell does being a "plastic" gun have anything to do with whether or not it should be +p or not?? The cartridge is still being discharged in an entirely metal chamber. Please elaborate on your opinion, that makes no sense whatsoever to me. In fact I shoot 185 gr +P GS and they actually feel SOFTER than the 230 grain Remington's I practice with! The standards set forth by S&W have nothing to do if the FRAME can handle the loads and pressures, its all about the chamber and action holding up to it.

 

[Steelshooter]

Plastic pistol has nothing to do with it. In the case of the M&P the stainless chassis is embedded, or rather cast, into the polymer portion of the frame. The slide and barrel are steel. +P has cracked plenty of steel and aluminum frames anyway.

I'm a big slow bullet fan that penetrates and crushes bone and gets into organs. I also like a regular JHP 230 grain .45 round because it has the same recoil impulse and same point of aim, point of impact, as a practice hardball round.



If you like .45 in +P more power to you. ;-) I carried +P 200 grain for a short time in the past but have returned to 230 grain hollow-points.



Personally I would not use any .45 against a bear. Minimum of 10mm for a semi-automatic but better to have a big honkin' revolver round.

 

[BrokenArrow]

FBI heavy cloth? WTH is that?

At that time it was:



Test Event 2 - Heavy Clothing. The gelatin block is covered with four layers of clothing: one layer of cotton T-shirt material (48 threads per inch); one layer of cotton shirt material (80 threads per inch); a 10 ounce down comforter in a cambric shell cover (232 threads per inch); and one layer of 13 ounce cotton denim (50 threads per inch). The block is shot at ten feet, measured from the muzzle to the front of the block.



I like CorBon's standard pressure 160g DPX. Penetrates and expands just fine (at least 12/.75 in bare gel and through 4 layers of denim), kicks less than the 230s, has more energy than the 230s, and even CB's 185 +P DPX.



Any other 230 JHP is just fine by me too, usually carry 230 GDs.

 

[Steelshooter]

I continue to be interested in Corbons DPX from what I have read about it. They also have a 185 grain version I believe. It does violate my 230 grain rule but it is still an interesting round. I think Evan Marshall carries the 165 grain Corbon DPX. In case anyone thinks that is significant.