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Discussion Starter #1
Just wondering if the M&P15 is any better/worse then any other name brand AR15 out there .... or are they all pretty much alike??



Also, I'm guessing then anything AR15 (parts, mags, accesories, ect.) would fit the M&P15 as well as any name AR type rifle.



Yes, if you must know I never owned one but am looking to ... hopefully soon.
 

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The AR platform is modular and standardized, well.....with the exception of Colt! Pretty much any AR component should work on another, sometimes a little fitting is necessary, but not often. Stag Arms was making the S&W, I think that S&W might be producing their own AR's now, I don't really know how much of the gun might be made in house, most AR brands are assembled from parts made by sub contractors.
 

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greatzippy said:
so in the end basically every AR out there is the same except the Name branded on it


No.

There are variances in quality. Some manufacturers/assemblers follow mil-specs to the T; some don't. You have to start with a quality upper receiver and quality lower receiver. Most of the major manufactures/assemblers do this. There is also variances in barrels, stocks, and small parts. Then the rifle must be assembled correctly, using the correct parts.



The M&P15 is a good AR. But they also get a good price for them.

If you will tell us what you are wanting out of the gun, we can give you better advise.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
YukonGlocker said:
If you will tell us what you are wanting out of the gun, we can give you better advise.


Mainly just target shooting to be honest. I was guessing at a price range of about $900-$1300 .... can't see spending more then that for how much I'll probably use it. I mean I do want a decent rifle & not a piece of Sh!t, just don't want to spend $2K for it either or get features I really don't need.

The only thing I can see myself adding is maybe a scope of some sort.



Although I just ran out to a local store about 15 miles away and had some words with the people there. One guy said he doesn't think that Smith has made the M&P15's NJ compliant yet .... so I'll have to call Smith tomorrow and ask about that.



But so far from what I'm being told Smith, Bushmaster & Stag Arms are all pretty good.
 

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What has to be done to be NJ compliant?

What features do you want?

What barrel length do you want?



Yes; S&W, Bushmaster, and Stag are all pretty good. It kind of depends on what configuration you are wanting. Out of those 3, the Stag will give you the most for your money.
 

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What I did was attend some local gun shows where they had a few different brands of AR's for sale, including the M&P15T and I just kept coming back to the M&P15T as the one that looked and felt the best in terms of fit and finish and decent out-of-the-box extras like the nice four-sided tactical rail and the flip up iron sights both front and rear. It is nice to have my Eo-Tech on there and flip the BUIS up so O can see both the sights and the EoTech red-dot simulatenously (if I want/need to).



I was initially leaning toward the Rock River Arms Tactical Entry but ultimately decided that the M&P15T was the "better" one to get. I wanted one that did not really need any "extra special" tuning out of the box.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
YukonGlocker said:
What has to be done to be NJ compliant?


Not 100% sure. The store clerk rambles off a few things like no bayonett mounts, fixed muzzle suppressor, and 15rd mags. I guess NJ would fall under the Post-Ban version listed on manufacturer web sites.



YukonGlocker said:
What features do you want?


If I knew that it'd be so much easier to figure this out. The removable carry handle is nice but having the flat top would allow mounting a scope/sight easier. Plus the flat top has the fold down rear sight so you could add a red dot sight yet still have access to the irons if needed.

Not sure what else I'd need/want to add to it. A tactical rail might be nice if I ever added a bi-pod or grip up front.



YukonGlocker said:
What barrel length do you want?


Assuming 16" is standard & probably the shortest I can go without special permits



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The M&P15T would be nice but not looking/wanting to spend that much (especially since I'm still wanting a .45 :roll: )

Maybe something like the Stag-15 with A.R.M.S. #40L Model 2T with a msrp of $1125.00 might have everything I might want. I mean it's pretty much identical to the M&P15A but has the rail system. On top of it I haven't hear anything negitive about Stag either.
 

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If you get a removable carry handle, it has a flat top receiver.



The Stag 2T is a nice rifle. You can put about any optic you want on it. (Although you should learn to shoot the irons well first.)

Have you thought about getting a standard 20" AR?
 

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I believe NJ is one of those states that still has the ban, too bad, you can still get the rifle/carbine but lose some of the "good" features!
 

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Morgan Walker said:
Which would you rather have stamped on your magazine well, Bambi with horns, or M&P15?


lol,



I'm an AK guy... I know nothing about AR's but that cracked me up.



To me an AR is a cute rifle :twisted:, but i by no means underestimate it. You can look at other platforms, for about a little more dough usually... Depends on what you are looking for in the rifle. If you want a scope .308 would be a little nicer, if you want .223 I would say get a red dot, once you get a red dot you will never go back to irons, heh... Of course .223 with a 4X scope works wonders. It all depends on what you want from the rifle!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Morgan Walker said:
Which would you rather have stamped on your magazine well, Bambi with horns, or M&P15?


Name's never bothered me either .... as long as it's a good product I could care less.



G56 said:
Stag Arms was making the S&W, I think that S&W might be producing their own AR's now, I don't really know how much of the gun might be made in house, most AR brands are assembled from parts made by sub contractors.


Besides, why pay more for a name stamp when you can get the same think by the same company for less??



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After thinking about it the Stag 2T may be the way for me to go, not overly expensive and has what I want + the rail system for future use. The M&P15T has a MSRP of $1700, way more then what I want to spend.
 

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The Stag 2T and S&W 15T are not the same gun for all intents and purposes. The lowers may both be made by CMT, and parts of the uppers may be from similar sources, but there's plenty of differences beyond that. The M&P, for example, has Troy front and rear flip down BUIS. It also has the Troy rails. Since S&W has brought the manufacture of the 15A and 15T in house, reports are that it switched the bolt carrier groups from CMT to LMTs, including Carrier o-rings and properly staked carrier keys. The Troy rails and sights themselves run $500.00 retail. There are at least two online dealers that will sell you a 15T for 1200 or 1210 out the door. Throw on top of that a 15 or 20 dollar FFL transfer fee in your area and $20 shipping, and your looking at $1245 essentially to your door. That total price minus the Troy add on's retail price means the lower and upper (w/o sites or rail) and the LMT BCG is $745. That's a great price, and virtually impossible to significantly beat with a Stag 2T, even if you order it as separates. The 2T may be $100 to $150 less if you really shopped around, but that's not enough to make it the best deal. In my opinion, you're really not paying a premium for a 15T's "S&W" or "M&P" badging -- you're simply getting a rifle with better certain component parts for just a little more money.



One more thing, and this actually could effect Stag or S&W ARs. Check the incredibly long posting (approx. 15 pages) over at AR15 regarding Stag uppers shooting so high that they can't be zeroed. Stag has apparently acknowledged the problem with its front BUISs and/or uppers in this regard, and is replacing/fixing uppers that have exhibited the problems. There are a few reports of M&Ps possibly suffering from the same problem, but I haven't seen any reports of what S&W and/or Stag is doing about the M&Ps showing the problem. I also haven't seen any clear information identifying a date or batch range that could be used to determine whether a particular Stag/S&W upper is likely to have the problem or not. I think you're probably going to be o.k. buying a newly built Stag or S&W, but there must still be old stock on store shelves that have the bad front sites (or uppers).
 

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Discussion Starter #19
onebohemian said:
There are at least two online dealers that will sell you a 15T for 1200 or 1210 out the door. Throw on top of that a 15 or 20 dollar FFL transfer fee in your area and $20 shipping, and your looking at $1245 essentially to your door.


Any clue as to who those dealers would be?? So far the lowest I've seen is about $1500.

Plus I have to worry about gettin a post ban NJ compliant version .... which is such a pain in the @ss.



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Actually I just called Smith and asked if they have a post ban version and the answer was no. He said they are working on a version to pass CA laws which are the most strict & open it up to all states but it's not expected to be out till late summer or fall.
 
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