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Discussion Starter #1
OK, I am a newbie. After about 350 rounds, it's obvious that I'm shooting about 3 or so inches down and to the left from the bullseye. This is even from only 18 feet away from a resting position. I'm wondering if it's my eyes or that the sights need some significant adjustment. Seems a bit too off to be just the sights. So according to the manual, is adjusting the sights a matter of just using an allen wrench on the set screw to loosen and then nudging with a brass punch? Something about pounding on my sights with a punch make me a bit nervous, but I suppose brass won't marr them.



Anybody else had to adjust their sights on the M&P 9c this much? Thanks!
 

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This is a common problem that has been discussed to a great extent. Often the problem seems to be shooter not firearm related. This is a common problem that occurs from anticipating the recoil and/or a right-handed shooter jerking the trigger. Suggestions would be practicing your trigger work, both at the range and with dry firing. Also, if you know very experienced shooters you may want to have them try it out to see if they are having the same problem. Good luck!
 

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Yup. My 40c came from the factory with both sights off center, making the poi way left. It also shoots low for me, as I tend to shoot it like I do my 1911s and expect the poi to be just above the front sight. The M&P wants me to cover my target.



For now I just adjust my sight picture to compensate, but I am planning on installing a Trijicon up front and Warren rear soon.
 

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Be prepared for a little more than a nudge to drift that rear sight. More like a bunt single. But before you do that, as suggested practice your trigger work. More often than not, these problems are shooter-induced.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
All great replies. I'll have to get more range time, but I swear I'm squeezing the trigger slowly rather than slapping it quickly. I've tried just about everything and I've just started aiming about 3.5 inches over the bullseye to hit it. What I need to do is have a marksman shoot the gun and see what he thinks. Try to isolate the problem.
 

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Low left is almost always a dead give away that it is the shooter and not the sights. The fact that you are a self-proclaimed newbie makes me think that even more. You'd be surprised how easy it is to jerk a trigger even when you're doing your best not to.



I took my brother out shooting one day and I could tell he was jerking the trigger so I reminded him to focus on a smooth trigger press. He said he wasn't jerking the trigger, so without his knowledge I loaded a snap-cap into his mag and watched the gun take a dive when he puled the trigger. He turned around and looked at me with an astonished look on his face.



Dry-fire a lot and try to keep that front sight still. Also I suggest loading snap caps in with your live ammo in your mags and see what happens when you pull the trigger and the gun goes "click" instead of "boom". Watch that front sight.



In case it is the sights that are off, get some calipers and measure it up.



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Discussion Starter #8
choochboost said:
Low left is almost always a dead give away that it is the shooter and not the sights. The fact that you are a self-proclaimed newbie makes me think that even more. You'd be surprised how easy it is to jerk a trigger even when you're doing your best not to.



I took my brother out shooting one day and I could tell he was jerking the trigger so I reminded him to focus on a smooth trigger press. He said he wasn't jerking the trigger, so without his knowledge I loaded a snap-cap into his mag and watched the gun take a dive when he puled the trigger. He turned around and looked at me with an astonished look on his face.



Dry-fire a lot and try to keep that front sight still. Also I suggest loading snap caps in with your live ammo in your mags and see what happens when you pull the trigger and the gun goes "click" instead of "boom". Watch that front sight.



In case it is the sights that are off, get some calipers and measure it up.


Yeah, I think you're right but like I said, I swear I'm sqeezing the trigger and not jerking it. I'll have to take your advice with the snap caps. I have a S&W 686 and come to think of it, I shoot that one low too, so I'll try differently. Do you guys use the pad of the finger or the first joint? I'm using the first joint, which might be the culprit.
 

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Mad Max,



It took 500 rounds or so for me to stop hitting low and left with my M&P 40c. I was anticipating recoil and "pushing" the gun with the trigger pull. As others have posted, dry fire helps.



I also did a lot of work with my 22-A, firing 500-600 rounds of .22 cal.



A bit like sex-practice is not a bad thing to have to do!
 

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Discussion Starter #11
40something said:
Mad Max,



It took 500 rounds or so for me to stop hitting low and left with my M&P 40c. I was anticipating recoil and "pushing" the gun with the trigger pull. As others have posted, dry fire helps.



I also did a lot of work with my 22-A, firing 500-600 rounds of .22 cal.



A bit like sex-practice is not a bad thing to have to do!


Thanks for the advice. Question- I thought dry firing a gun did damage to the pin. Is that incorrect?
 

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my .02 cents

Being in the army they do sight pictures and aiming a lot different than fun shooting. So my first time with my full size .40 I found a lot of errors and with many dry-fires I quit anticipating the boom and got that trigger just where I wanted it now me and my full size are best friends I tell it where to go and it listens (what a good woman) :wink: :wink:
 

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Fascinating!



I have the _EXACT_ same problem. Very tight groups, but all of them are down and left. I have a s&w 6046 (.40) that I have shot many many thousands of rounds through, and dont have this problem. It was kinda making me mad at the range!
While I am not ruling out user error, I can safely say that I was concentrating hard on my trigger while firing (as I thought it might be me somehow) but I still shot, very consistently, down and left.



I should have saved the targets. The groups are so tight, you would have thought I was actually aiming there.
 

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hondaman said:
Fascinating!



I have the _EXACT_ same problem. Very tight groups, but all of them are down and left. I have a s&w 6046 (.40) that I have shot many many thousands of rounds through, and dont have this problem. It was kinda making me mad at the range!
While I am not ruling out user error, I can safely say that I was concentrating hard on my trigger while firing (as I thought it might be me somehow) but I still shot, very consistently, down and left.



I should have saved the targets. The groups are so tight, you would have thought I was actually aiming there.


i have a 357 revolver that i am dead on with but this semi auto i am off. i am not sure what the deal is
 

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One thing I do during my dry-fire exercises is balance a quarter on the front sight. You should be able to smoothly pull the trigger back, hear the click, and keep the quarter on the front sight. I've found it more difficult to do on my M&P than my SIG, though.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Just a follow up on my problem. I went to the range and got some grip, stance, etc advice from a marksman who teaches the classes at the range. He did the old snap cap trick on me and it was pretty obvious that I was 1) Flinching like a little girl for the recoil and 2) Not using the right grip/stance, Once I worked at these things, I was hitting the bullseye and slightly right at 25 feet away. All hits at least in the black ring and most about 1" away from the bullseye. (No mag drop issues, BTW)




I just have to get used to let the gun fire the bullet and resist flinching. Being a new shooter again (grew up shooting) I have to get over the explosion and let the shot surprise me instead of trying to cause it be jerking the trigger. As he put it, "You're a big boy and you're firing a little 9MM. It's not going to knock you down."
 

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Just for the record, a brass punch WILL mar the rear sight if it slips when you are banging the crap out of it. At least that's what I had to do to get mine out.



Glad you fixed your stance and grip Max, that's what it took for me to get consistent groups, a little lesson then I sent 3 rounds through the same hole at 7 yards. :twisted:
 

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I have actually found that I shoot very well when I'm in an IDPA match but can flinch when I'm just taking my time and shooting paper.



I think that I don't even think about recoil when at IDPA, I just go front sight, squeeze, bang.



during slow fire I have more time to subconsciously think about it
 
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