Pre-wall trigger 'click' before reaching wall

1137 Views 11 Replies 4 Participants Last post by Pranqster, 2 mo ago

Battler

Hold gun upright, finger off trigger, rack a couple times, take up slack in trigger, and before the triggerpull wall, 'click!'.

FWIW I have all the Apex stuff on there; but I think it was doing it before (was hoping the new parts would clear it up)

I've isolated it to a point I can repeat with the slide off. I don't know the names of the part, that long protruding thing from the trigger bar ends up to the side of that open-claw looking thing. I don't know if it's meant to sometimes travel to the side during the firing cycle. I confirmed this was the travel case by racking the gun (it's a CORE) with the firing safety out (I'd peek down the hole).

I have a video here of how the parts are fitting together when it happens, turn up your sound.

M&P2 trigger bar gets out of position - YouTube

The click in the video is the click I get firing the gun. Now - here I induced it by pushing it to the side a bit; but not sure if that's meant to be possible. However, the key problem is firing the gun.

Is this something rolling the dice on a new sear block or trigger bar is worth trying? Or try to bend the sear bar in?

Thanks.

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M1A4ME

· #2 · 4 mo ago

Sorry, no idea. I got both mine out and tried it with and with out the slide on them frame and neither would do that.

I did notice, on the .45, that the piece the trigger bar moves that in turn moves the sear seemed loose on the pin where it rotates. Had not noticed the way it starts to twist to the side a little as it begins to move before it makes contact with the sear and then moves it. Don't know if you see that in yours or not.

But neither of mine will make that noise even if I pull the trigger bar a little bit to the right side of the frame.

Sounds like something moves fast enough/far enough to smack something else but I don't see what's moving in that video.

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Battler

Discussion Starter · #3 · 4 mo ago

M1A4ME said:
Sorry, no idea. I got both mine out and tried it with and with out the slide on them frame and neither would do that.

I did notice, on the .45, that the piece the trigger bar moves that in turn moves the sear seemed loose on the pin where it rotates. Had not noticed the way it starts to twist to the side a little as it begins to move before it makes contact with the sear and then moves it. Don't know if you see that in yours or not.

But neither of mine will make that noise even if I pull the trigger bar a little bit to the right side of the frame.

Sounds like something moves fast enough/far enough to smack something else but I don't see what's moving in that video.

The key is that it gets in that position before the shot based on the racking. In the video I show it in the bad position having put it there, my point is if I rack the gun (ironically too, with it upright), it gets into that state. It's not a bit to the side but hopped track. Doing it manually is tricky to get in that state; but racking the gun can get me there.

I.e. I know why it makes the noise (in the video, I show it hopping into the correct position which does 'click', then pull the trigger again with it in proper position and there's of course no noise).

The reason racking the gun gets me there made me wonder if even something could be out of spec wrt how the slide pushes things around. Am hoping this may be a known thing to MP fans here. . . .

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M1A4ME

· #4 · 4 mo ago

I'll have to watch that video some more. I kept trying to catch the moment it moved and never did.

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M1A4ME

· #5 · 4 mo ago

Well, now I do. It stops, lined up just a bit to the right (if I was looking at it from the rear) and then jumps left before pushing the piece rearwards that moves the sear. The click may be from it making contact with the inside of the frame when it jumps to the left.

But again, neither of mine do that. I wonder if that tail piece and the rest of that end of the trigger bar are bent slightly to the right on your pistol?

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HEADKNOCKER

· #6 · 4 mo ago

The trigger return spring is what causes the tension on the trigger bar moving to the side, this action is the disconnector, there is a step in the slide that pushes on the nub of the trigger bar that also pushes the striker safety plunger. It does this as the slide cycles & disconnects the trigger bar from the sears teardrop shaped bump... then resets as you let the trigger come forward.
I would Assume that you have a lightweight trigger return spring in your setup & that is the issue.
It should be in the position to push the sear when forward, then once the sear is activated, push the trigger bar outward & it should reset the sear.
Here let me look on one I have sitting here.
YUP, that's how it works...

Try putting the factory trigger return spring in by removing the locking block = 1/8" roll pin + trigger pivot pin & slide stop lever
Good Luck, watch the Apex video if you have any problems.
Let us know if that fixes the issue.
Could also be the extension that goes back into the sear housing might have a bur on it that is catching.
Gary/Hk

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Battler

Discussion Starter · #7 · 4 mo ago

HEADKNOCKER said:
The trigger return spring is what causes the tension on the trigger bar moving to the side, this action is the disconnector, there is a step in the slide that pushes on the nub of the trigger bar that also pushes the striker safety plunger. It does this as the slide cycles & disconnects the trigger bar from the sears teardrop shaped bump... then resets as you let the trigger come forward.
I would Assume that you have a lightweight trigger return spring in your setup & that is the issue.
It should be in the position to push the sear when forward, then once the sear is activated, push the trigger bar outward & it should reset the sear.
Here let me look on one I have sitting here.
YUP, that's how it works...

Try putting the factory trigger return spring in by removing the locking block = 1/8" roll pin + trigger pivot pin & slide stop lever
Good Luck, watch the Apex video if you have any problems.
Let us know if that fixes the issue.
Could also be the extension that goes back into the sear housing might have a bur on it that is catching.
Gary/Hk

I have still to fully digest this, and i don't know all the terms. I recently put in the Apex spring which is heavier than the factory one (I even measured the pull before and after). I think the gun always did this but I didn't mentally register it so not sure. I fired the gun before putting the Apex/heavier reset spring in, I was uncomfortable by how light the trigger was.

I was actually wondering if I could have something out of spec. My fear is that something could be the slide or the frame. That racking the slide makes it move to the side (or not) just too early or too late.

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M1A4ME

· #8 · 4 mo ago

I think there was a table at one time. Showed parts combinations to get to the area of the trigger pull weight you wanted. If I remember correctly, the Apex trigger return spring did show and increase of trigger pull weight vs. the factory trigger return spring. Both on my 2.0's have the factory trigger return spring in them, the trigger pull is right at 3 lbs. and neither one moves AND makes that clicking noise.
Just checked my .45 again. The trigger bar moves/makes contact with the part that moves the sear right in the middle of that pieced. All the time it's lined up there, whether to the front or rear.

The trigger bar makes contact with the right side slide release lever arm in the frame and can't move further to the right side at the back - unless I go to the trouble of bending the back of the trigger bar to the right so it would sit farther to the right.

Does your trigger bar contact the right side slide release lever?

Looking at the video again your trigger bar appears to be making contact with the frame as it moves rearward. Mine doesn't get anywhere near that close unless I push it over there with my finger/thumb. Appears your trigger bar may be bent to the right at some point.

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Battler

Discussion Starter · #9 · 4 mo ago

M1A4ME said:
I think there was a table at one time. Showed parts combinations to get to the area of the trigger pull weight you wanted. If I remember correctly, the Apex trigger return spring did show and increase of trigger pull weight vs. the factory trigger return spring. Both on my 2.0's have the factory trigger return spring in them, the trigger pull is right at 3 lbs. and neither one moves AND makes that clicking noise.
Just checked my .45 again. The trigger bar moves/makes contact with the part that moves the sear right in the middle of that pieced. All the time it's lined up there, whether to the front or rear.

The trigger bar makes contact with the right side slide release lever arm in the frame and can't move further to the right side at the back - unless I go to the trouble of bending the back of the trigger bar to the right so it would sit farther to the right.

Does your trigger bar contact the right side slide release lever?

Looking at the video again your trigger bar appears to be making contact with the frame as it moves rearward. Mine doesn't get anywhere near that close unless I push it over there with my finger/thumb. Appears your trigger bar may be bent to the right at some point.

I do hope it's as simple/cheap as the trigger bar. Thanks for giving me something to look into (when I get back to my guns).

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Pranqster

· #10 · 2 mo ago

This may be too late for you, but I had a similar issue with my trigger bar and sear. The part of the trigger bar that contacts the sear (the loop) was not straight, and only contacted the sear on the edge which actually deformed the spot where they came into contact. I replaced the sear with an Apex one, and bent the loop a little bit so it contacted the sear fully. I don't remember if it clicked like yours, but I wouldnt be surprised if that little loop slipped on the deformed area causing a click.
Check it out:

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M1A4ME

· #11 · 2 mo ago

Some times it's the little things we may not even notice (till we get another one side by side with it and then the issue is easier to see.)

I've put Apex sears in three of my M&Ps but never have in any of the Shields. I think it was because the Shields seemed to have better trigger pulls out of the box.

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Pranqster

· #12 · 2 mo ago

M1A4ME said:
Some times it's the little things we may not even notice (till we get another one side by side with it and then the issue is easier to see.)

I've put Apex sears in three of my M&Ps but never have in any of the Shields. I think it was because the Shields seemed to have better trigger pulls out of the box.

Youre right. The stock trigger was decent, and I really only changed it because I don't like hinged triggers.

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