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My new MP40 was bought first and foremost to be my home defense weapon. I should have ordered it with night sights but I didn't cuz Bud's didn't have the version WITH night sights and WITHOUT mag safety, so lo and behold I need a set. After some research I've decided on the XS Sight Systems 24/7 Express Big Dot. Having said that, I spoke with the folks at XS today to inquire when they would be available for the MP, but learned something interesting in the process. It seems that for technical reasons relaed to the MP slide, XS can't design the MP site system with nights sites on the rear; in other words, the front sight will be the only one of the pair with Tritium. Is this a problem?
 

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I can't imagine what problem X-S could possibly have with installing tritium in their M&P rear sight, but all of my defensive weapons have tritium inserts in the front sight only by choice.
 

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David Smith said:
I can't imagine what problem X-S could possibly have with installing tritium in their M&P rear sight, but all of my defensive weapons have tritium inserts in the front sight only by choice.


Thanks for the reply David. Would you explain the rationale/theory behind that choice. Thanks again.
 

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Perhaps not enough material to make the hole and the cutout below the notch to keep the sight one piece?



I don't have my gun here to look at, but that would be my best guess from looking at the big-dot design.
 

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2Barrels said:
... After some research I've decided on the XS Sight Systems 24/7 Express Big Dot. ...


2Barrels,

Have you extensively fired any pistol with these sights? Have you discussed them with anyone who has? I know several competitors who have had them installed on their pistols, only to get rid of them (the sights).

--Lin
 

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rledwards said:
2Barrels,

Have you extensively fired any pistol with these sights? Have you discussed them with anyone who has? I know several competitors who have had them installed on their pistols, only to get rid of them (the sights).

--Lin


It's a good question. I've seen the same. But largley the explanation for the dislike is that the big dot is far too large to make any accurate shots, and is really only good for up close and fast.
 

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2Barrels said:
[quote name='David Smith']I can't imagine what problem X-S could possibly have with installing tritium in their M&P rear sight, but all of my defensive weapons have tritium inserts in the front sight only by choice.


Thanks for the reply David. Would you explain the rationale/theory behind that choice. Thanks again.[/quote]



I rationalize the tritium front only concept from a strictly defensive shooting viewpoint. In a stressful situation, I only want to focus on the front sight & the threat. IMHO, trying to line up 3 dots abreast or stack 2 dots in the dark takes too much concentration when I need to be focused on my threat (try a night shoot sometime, juggling a gun, light, reloading, etc...). My muscle memory will align the rear sight adequately up close (inside 15 yards for me). If the range to the target is far enough to warrant a precise sight picture, I've alway been able to use a "shadow-box" effect to center the tritium dot inside the plain rear sight using ambient light. (distance from the threat = time to make the shot). I'm a "front sight, press" kinda shooter - the rear sight is just a frame I look thru to see the front sight as time &/or distance allows. I hope my explaination makes some sense to you.
 

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'The set-up you describe should run just fine. Hilton Yam will be producing a rear sight (with ot without tritium) fairly soon.



RE: the Big Dot and precision shooting. I run this set-up on a duty pistol. It'll do if you will. Most folks are wont to take advantage of even the most "precise" sights. Force-on-Force training taught me that finding that front sight while under a "lethal" threat is double tuff. Hence the Big Dot.



FWIW, Yeager has a video showing him getting hits on steel at 100 yards with the Big Dot. I'm drawing a blank on the details of his name, but he is big over at GlockTalk and is a trainer in TN, I think. The video is on his company's site.
 

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You can keep the Big Dots; I've tried them and think they arent worth much other than hits on man-sized targets at under 15 yards. For me, I can produce better results using either Warren or Heinie sights and those are the sights I'll stick with.



Bloodnut - the person you are thinking of is James Yeager, owner of Tactical Response based in Camden, TN. He is a HUGE advocate of the Big Dots. To the best of my knowledge he is the only professional trainer pushing the Big Dot sights.
 

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NC - yup that's him. Was a little punchy when I wrote that and couldn't come up with the name. Thanks.



The Big Dot seems to be one of those pieces of kit that people either love or hate. For *me* and my aging eyes, I am able to find this sight quickly under pressure. I am able to qualify consistently in the mid-high 90's out to 25 yards with the Big Dot set-up. Given my particular circumstances, my primary concern is being able to get fast, solid hits at "living room" distances and closer. They work much better for me than the three-dot Trijicons that came on my Grock.



As always, YMMV.
 

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I put an XS Big Dot express sight on my Kahr MK40 about a year ago. At first I found it difficult to use. I got frustrated and stopped using the gun for a while. Then I went back to it, determined to make it work, and put a couple thousand rounds thru. Now I actually like it. I find that I can get on target faster with it than with any other sight. The trade off is that I lose a bit on accuracy for slow fire. I don't think that this is big problem though, as my primary goal is 5-6 inch groups with the greatest speed possible. That usually means (depending on the distance) a flash sight picture or Applegate-style point shooting where one brings the gun up into the line of sight but doesn't get a real sight picture. In either case the Big Dot really sticks out.
 

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Frank Borelli just published and article discussing his 10 year old G19. One of the few mods made was the addition of the Big Dot. Here's what he had to say, "The other modification I've made to my Glock 19 is the addition of XS Sights 24/7 Small Dot sights. This shallow-V rear and easy to find DOT front makes quick sight alignment in high risk time compressed situations easy to find and line up. As much as everyone talks about the importance of the front sight, I think these sights would be obvious in their value. My qualification scores haven't gone down at all since I installed them and in some instances my speed of shot placement has improved."



Now, I have yet to see Borelli write a negative comment on a piece of gear. He provides, however, a perspective of a third party. He experience mirrors mine. The Big Dots aren't for everybody or every mission. I'm not a SWAT dude or sniper. My primary concern is dealing with a large motivated thug in close quarters. Under these conditions, the Big Dot shines. If I was taking head shots across a parking lot, I'd find something else.



FWIW, I routinely see folks who turn up their nose at gear without giving it a fair shake. Running a couple of mags thru a gun and calling it no good is a bit short-sighted. The BD's do take some getting used to and you have dial in on your hold for longer/precision shots.

I note that Borelli is running a small dot. The principle still holds.



Edited cause I caint tipe.
 

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rledwards said:
[quote name='2Barrels']... After some research I've decided on the XS Sight Systems 24/7 Express Big Dot. ...


2Barrels,

Have you extensively fired any pistol with these sights? Have you discussed them with anyone who has? I know several competitors who have had them installed on their pistols, only to get rid of them (the sights).

--Lin[/quote]

Im an armed guard and i had some mounted ona Glock 22. My accuracy decreased some but it did allow for faster shots i could still get good center mass hits but the days of eating the X out of the target were gone. They are fine for duty use but for plinking or competition...no.
 

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XS sights are done. I have the debut set on my M&P 40. I am at work at the SHeriff's Office now but will post a picture or two on my Bowie Tactical area ASAP. The front is tritium but the rear is not. The sight is not tall enough to handle the tritium tube. More on this later I will be making my own tritium rear and will post it for you all to see and decide if you like it. If response is good I will produce them. If any of you are at the SHOT show stop by the XS booth my 40 will be on display with the new sights. CHECK 360 David.
 

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David we traded PMs on this subject. Please email me when your ready with the tritium rear and the big dot front. I'll would like to send you both of my slides and have the XS installed. The lack of XS Big Dots is the only thing keeping my M&Ps in the safe. My Glocks, 19, 17 and 22 all have these sights and I like to keep my guns consistant with the same sighting system. If you need my email please PM me and I'll PM it to you back.



Thanks

Larry
 

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+1 I would love to put my glock in the safe for good.. I just waiting on the xs big dot sights.

Do you have a rough idea what the cost on the sight will be? Can't wait to see the pictures.
 
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